[Split] The Pain of Cadsuane

[Kaitlin 22]

Caddy is excellent. I agree with all that said she treats people the way they deserve to be treated. And, as much as I like little Momo, she was acting childish. Caddy was trying to tell Moiraine to keep her skin, and even more important things, intact.

[Mea 0]

She's being rude! She's bullying Rand witch only makes him more angry! If she really was so strong and amazing she wouldn't have to make herself seem better by making other people seem worse!

[Marie 73]

Rand doesn't listen to anything but bullying.

[Sivart Reborn 7]

Caddie reminds me of me if I were that old...

I don't really like her or strongly dislike her. She really just seems to fill the role Moiraine left empty.

[Kaitlin 22]

She's not acting that way because she's really feeling those things.

 

There was a boy in first grade that got away with everything at home. He was disturbed, and getting much more violent. He swung a puppy by it's tale and threw it, nearly killing it. He would take things from the teacher's desk. He brought his knife to school and stuck it through a little girl's sweater.

 

If he had been expelled right then there would have been no help for him. The teacher knew she had to do something herself, and so brought me to stand next to her so that we would both seem more imposing. This was in the hallway and without the other children around. She told him everything that he did wrong, and got very very close to his face and told him to look at her. She told him to look at her face and see what was happening. She was very red and angry, and not forgiving or halfway smiling in the way that adults always were before. She scared him. But when he went back in the classroom the anger was completely gone. We spoke about what to do next. It was strategy to save this boy. She really worked with him after that, and he trusted her and treated her a little like a mother. His mother gave him no boundries at all. This teacher showed him that certain things he did were completely unacceptable, and there would be consequences more than just seeing someone angry.... which must have shocked him enough!

 

Anyway, some people would definitely have issues with her approach. But, I know how that boy was, and I know how he is now. She saved him.

 

I think this is what Caddy is trying to do.

[Mea 0]

But she's not just telling Rand what she thinks he's doing wrong she's insulting him! She tries to take over and tell him what to do, she doesn't understand that it's his decision. And he's not a disturbed kidd, he's the Dragon Reborn and he's doing a good jobb.

[Sivart Reborn 7]

Good job? That's what you call that?

[Olivia 26]

Well there is no guide to being the Dragon Reborn. He didn't know wtf to do in the beginning, but he decided to try to unite the nations so they would have a chance to stand against the new Trolloc Wars.

 

Yes, he caused a lot of war and strife, but those kinds of things were partially happening before he came along or were caused by events outside his control.

 

Now, the Aiel are almost all united for the first time, as are Tear, Illian, Cairhien, Andor, and the Borderlanders aren't killing the southerners either. There are rebels and splitoff groups and the Seanchan, because absolute peace is still far off. But I'd say he isn't doing too badly considering he is meant to break the world anew (which might just be a metaphor for destroying the modern nations' boundaries and such and creating a more unified world). He's not particularly brilliant, but he knows enough to let other people have control and be in charge of what they know best: like setting up regents to rule in some places and letting generals lead most of the army and trying to restore Andor to Elayne.

[Kaitlin 22]

No, if he continues the way he is going he will only destroy the world, because he has forgotten himself. This is a major theme in the books. It's hard to understand because actually the sort of personality type Rand has is being rewarded in popular culture, but it is a woefully damaged one.

 

Rand will not respond to coddling. He would not have listened to Cadsuane if she tried to be his best friend, or even worse - his underling. The people in power are the ones that especially need to understand humility, and so being the Dragon Reborn means that he needs to learn what she is teaching him even more than anyone else.

 

He doesn't like the way she talks to him. It upsets his feelings. Good. His feelings need to be addressed and identified. It is difficult, but so is life.

[Marie 73]

Rand has never much liked being told a different option than the one he has planned. Even if he knows the other option is better. In book three he argued with Moiraine more for the sake of it, than because he actually disagreed. It wasn't until she was dead he went "o rly, maybe she was right"

 

Cad has seen the results of Moiraine's efforts and is trying a different approach. And honestly, she's 295 years old. Do you really think she would have that much patience for a 22 year old kid? Yes, he's the DR, but that doesn't mean his automatically smart and capable. It means he's someone else reborn.

[Ishmael Moridin 0]

That's a good thought Kate, I had never thought about her actions from this POV.

[Kaitlin 22]

Rand has never much liked being told a different option than the one he has planned. Even if he knows the other option is better. In book three he argued with Moiraine more for the sake of it, than because he actually disagreed. It wasn't until she was dead he went "o rly, maybe she was right"

 

Cad has seen the results of Moiraine's efforts and is trying a different approach. And honestly, she's 295 years old. Do you really think she would have that much patience for a 22 year old kid? Yes, he's the DR, but that doesn't mean his automatically smart and capable. It means he's someone else reborn.

 

True.

 

Moiraine did the best she could, but she's practically Rand's age to Cadsuane as well. Caddy just has a whole lot of experience, and I'm glad she showed up to give a mature perspective!

 

@ajit: Thanks, hehe!

[Vertex 23]

She isn't acting mature! She bickers with him like a teen girl... or maybe I just imagine that.

[Kaitlin 22]

You think all girlies aren't as good as boys. *pats, gives a cookie*

[Tosh 8]

I agree that Rand might need someone like the person you described cad as but really. What good has Cadsuane done? As far as I can remember she hasn't even given him any advice, or taught him humility or whatever its called. The only reason Rand is being moderatly polite to her is because of the viewing Min had. The only thing Cad has done so far is being rude to pretty much everybody and walking around saying how much better she is than everyone else and not taking advice from anyone because shes a really really really old hag and supposedly knows better than them. The way you are saying Rand is behaving, althought hes not very old I'll give you that.

 

So, I think Cad should be/do what you said but we haven't seen any of it so far. aMoL please.

 

Now when I think about it she did save Rands ass twice (with the help of others mind, it was not only her) now. But thats beside the point!