[Split] Moiraine/Siuan Redux

[Marie 73]

OT: I should change Olivia's title to "Living WoT Encyclopedia"

 

I think of other woman as attractive without any sexual feelings. I also make comments about other women's assets. I mention this just to explain why it's posssible I never noticed Moiraine doing any of these things and associated it with any sexual connotations.

 

I like to follow an inductive approach: So, until I actually see Moiraine act as silly over girls as she does over boys, I'm inclinded to see her as straight. Or at least show the same signs as Galina did; it's obvious she likes women even without her man-hating speeches.

[Kaitlin 22]

Well, the trouble is that we aren't privvy to Moiraine's PoVs very often. So far she hasn't actually shown that she loves Thom through any PoV. It's just inferred from her letter, and from other little hints.

 

Our major source of PoV from Moiraine or Siuan is NS. They both just got out of the Tower, and hadn't been with men (in Moiraine's case at all, in Siuan's.. at least 6 or however many years).

 

It's just a feeling I get, with Moiraine especially. I sort of know what Olivia means by bringing up Moiraine's attentiveness with Egwene, though I don't think Moiraine would take advantage of a young girl like that.

[Olivia 26]

I sort of know what Olivia means by bringing up Moiraine's attentiveness with Egwene, though I don't think Moiraine would take advantage of a young girl like that.

 

Not take advantage of, exactly... maybe she saw the same eagerness in Egwene as she did in herself, or Siuan, all those years ago....and that eagerness led to going to the Tower, meeting a pillow-friend and becoming lovers. Maybe Moiraine wanted to spend time with Egwene and "re-live" the gool ol' days, even if it was just a slight fantasy.

 

In all likelihood though, I am just blowing smoke. Like I said in my previous post, was some flimsy evidence.

 

OT:

OT: I should change Olivia's title to "Living WoT Encyclopedia"

 

*beams*

[Marie 73]

I cannot deny (since Laura1 is a witness..otherwise I probably would!) that I thought something went on between Amalisa and Moiraine. However, back then I saw lesbians everywhere.

 

Labels are tricky, but I tend to think like:

 

If woman prefers men, she's straight

If woman prefers women, she's gay

If woman doesn't care, just wants someone good in bed or in the kitchen, she's bi

 

In my not so humble opinion, Moiraine is just naturally attracted to men; if given the choice between having a relationship with a woman or a man, she'd pick the man (unless that man was Rand, obviously). Not because she sees anything wrong with same sex relationships - WoT society is thankfully free of such homophobia - but because she just likes men more.

 

A true bisexual, someone who likes both sexes equally (or near enough), is rather rare. Or at least according to Dr. Drew . But I'm inclined to agree. If Moiraine is attracted to men 99.87% of the time, and women .13%, she isn't bi: She's a straight woman with good taste

 

Anyway, I hope that explains why even though I can believe Mo did the deed with Amalisa, I still see her as straight. And why I consider Kait a lesbian...

 

 

...and it's not just because I like being able to say "I'm friends with a redheaded lesbian"!

[Kaitlin 22]

Being bi is more than just not caring and wanting someone good in bed or in the kitchen, though. It's about the person themselves more than whether they happen to be a man or a woman.

 

And I get the feeling that those two are interested in a lover's personality mainly.. whether or not they are specifically male. But also, they enjoy men mainly.

 

You can call me what you like, but I'm probably much more bisexual than over toward being a lesbian, even though I even call myself that sometimes!

[Marie 73]

I'm sorry...but you've lost me

[jan 14]

Being bi is more than just not caring and wanting someone good in bed or in the kitchen, though. It's about the person themselves more than whether they happen to be a man or a woman.

I agree!!

 

But about Moiraine and Siuan, I still think it was more a matter of two lonely girls seeking each other out in the Tower, which isn't exactly a cakewalk.

[Marie 73]

*finds herself* Oh, and I know bi means more than just finding someone good in bed. I think people are missing my point, but that's normal

 

I just find it hard to believe Moiraine or Siuan would engage in a same sex relationship outside of that confined enviroment.

 

...and we're going so off topic! So I edited out all my crap about sexuality, because really, I don't want to get beat by Jan.

[jan 14]

*curious* Could you forward all those deleted bits to my mail?

[Marie 73]

For a cookie I'll send you anything!

[jan 14]

*gives entire box of cookies*

[Ekho 52]

I think most of what goes on between pilow friends in the tower doesn't necessarily define that characters sexuality, as it is a stressfull place and everyone needs some comfort

[Marie 73]

I agree, and I also think people are projecting onto Moiraine. Which is what we usually do here

 

I also now realize people have a hard time grasping my views on sexuality because I was taking the biological route as opposed to the social one: nature vs. nurture. I think it's pretty safe to say that Moiraine was born attracted to males, i.e. a heterosexual. She liked men before the Tower (Corey), she liked them after the Tower (Ryne, random cute boys, etc.), even during the Tower (that one guard person that I'm sure Olivia will give the correct title for).

 

With Siuan there wasn't physical attraction ("oh Siuan has such pretty eyes!"), but seems as Laura2 says, comfort.

 

I say all this not to go against anyone else - since for the first time people for the most part are on my side!- but just to explain my late night ramblings that usually don't make sense the next morning.

[Kaitlin 22]

*sighs* This is what stinks about never being agreed with about anything! I don't know why I state my opinion at all sometimes, though at least here you guys don't pick people to bits.

 

*believes in nature as well* I was taking that for granted as being the main basis for all of this, actually, when explaining what I thought.

 

Thinking these things about Moiraine and Siuan has come after actually being silly enough to think very hard about their characters and motives. I'm not just assuming things based on life experiences I've had. I just do not think being lovers with each other was an isolated thing. I'm not doubting they liked men, or were with them. I'm not even saying it I believe it was a large number of women I believe they may have been with. I just don't think that in twenty years time the possibility can be totally ruled out, and I personally think that they did have other female lovers.

[Ekho 52]

Maybe we should write a nice letter to RJ and ask him:P