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Kaitlin

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Posts posted by Kaitlin

  2. Random XIII

    in Chatterbox

    Posted

    @ katie: if you come to chicago you must call me! :lol: but first you need to find out your skype name :)

     

    I added you on skype a bit ago, Liv. Or it should have gone through.

     

    The buttercup a day version of billie jean came up today on my ipod while it was on shuffle. I was driving. It made me think of the MJ macros here.

     

    One of my friends wants to bring stuff over to purify my apartment. When she was watering my plants while I was gone last week she said she saw a ghost. :P It sounds like a good excuse for a party.

  4. What Moiraine chose (Spoilers)

    in Kesiera

    Posted

    I'm not sure what I posted last night. :)

     

    Butler's commentary had a lot to do with chivalry, and Rand's notion of protecting women sort of being a part of a mode of chivalry. Putting a woman up on a pedestal and making choices to protect her takes away her right as a human being to make choices that could endanger her.

     

    Did Rand try to do that with Egwene and Avi and get messed up because his foe was Lanfear?

     

    Moiraine made her choices but though she acted before Rand's decisions found a conclusion I don't believe she really took away anything from him.

     

    She did, I feel, take away Lan's choices. He knew about them and I agree that she probably did the best she could have done for his sake.

     

    There's no way she would have passed the bond right to Nynaeve. Moiraine knew how destructive Warders can get after losing Aes Sedai. Also, Nynaeve was an Accepted. Nyn knew nothing about a bond transfer. Even if Moiraine could do it without the other woman knowing I don't think she would have. Moiraine suspected almost everyone else of being Black Ajah, and like Laura was talking about Myrelle really was the best one to help him.

  7. What Moiraine chose (Spoilers)

    in Kesiera

    Posted

    Well not the same-same, you know...Moiraine loves him like a feral brother. Now I've lost my train of thought again.

     

    With this I pictured them out in the Blight and those mountains above the Waste just fighting and living all ferally, except that Moiraine still looked ready for a noble's dance party at any moment.

     

    Dance party. Yes. Now I am picturing dance parties of the 80s. Maybe I should just stop!

     

    As far as Moiraine doing what she does out of love: I agree and know that's why she did it. She is Cairhienin. She shows love by having people shipped off to god knows where doing exactly what they don't want to do. :) I love her character for her Cairhieninness.

     

    By upfront I don't pretend that Nynaeve is not oblivious. In some ways all of RJ's women are manipulative. I think he missed the memo of that sort of behavior being common to one gender only if they have no other means of having their needs met. Women aren't equal in wot but they are more equal in some ways than many groups of women are irl, but still they manipulate. I think Nynaeve is a badly practiced Moiraine though. I don't see it as much as Elayne! I like Nynaeve for herself, however. Her fibbing, bullish, sometimes frightened self.

     

    Rand just lost Moiraine and was in a pretty bad state. Also, Egwene and Avi were badly hurt and maybe dead, and yet he was still in a certain frame of mind to want to save Lan from killing himself. I think he cared a lot about Moiraine _and_ Lan. there was another time when Lan was near death and Rand could have let him die and yet he could not. Lan and his deathwishes.

  8. What Moiraine chose (Spoilers)

    in Kesiera

    Posted

    Everyone knows I accepted the bribe! :)

     

    The thing I find tricky about the Moiraine/Rand/Lanfear doorway thing is that Moiraine saw it all beforehand and had very little choice in the matter, so she believes, unless she wants to see Rand dead or turned evil. She *really* didn't seem to like the idea of doing what she was going to do even though she had talked about needing to die for her cause so many times before.

     

    Although I'm not siding with her. I'm just not siding against her either. (I'm not saying you are siding one way or another either :lol: ) The way I feel about is that outside of her knowing about everything beforehand... her getting thrown under the cart in the beginning of that disaster gave Rand some time to try and fight Lanfear off on his own.

     

    He got the chance to start to make his choice without being able to actually finish choosing to either attack Lanfear with the intent of killing her or joining with her to save Egwene and Avi. At that point I feel he'd wasted time not being able to decide and was no longer able to fight off Lanfear.

     

    Moiraine saved his ass. I don't know if he would have been able to stop Lanny at that point.

     

    Although, I do feel for him. I don't feel that the way he behaved having to do with Moiraine was entirely jerky, chivalrous or controlling although he was definitely that way with a lot of other women. Hell, all the other women. With Moiraine he seemed to actually care about what she thought and felt, which is why I don't really wish death on him in later books.

     

    As far as Lan goes... Moiraine controlled him. Maybe the women try to control him because he is so stoney and unresponsive. His stubbornness is annoying as is his deathwish. Moiraine and the others do treat him like a child, and that's not really ok.

     

    When Lan falls in love he does so with a very up front woman. Nynaeve tells people how she thinks it is, and she doesn't fool around. That's what he's attracted to, and Moiraine's methods aren't really like that. I not saying there's something romantic between Mo/Lan, but they do have a Warder and Aes Sedai relationship. Her usual methods don't work as well with Lan in the same way that Nynaeve's do. He just seems to get more stubborn and stoney about it. I can see why Moiraine would have chosen to manipulate him (and take his choices away) but I don't have to like it.

     

    Bah, I want to say more about this but I'll wait until my thoughts are clearer.

  9. What Moiraine chose (Spoilers)

    in Kesiera

    Posted

    If you haven't read FoH get out now! I'm not hiding anything in spoiler tags.

     

    :)

     

    Marie linked this to me, which has Leigh Butler's Commentary on the chapter after Moiraine jumped through the doorway.

     

    The whole notion of choice is interesting here.

     

    This is all that we said on it so far:

     

    Kat: Oh Leigh Butler

    I read the first few of these

     

    Marie: I only kept reading because of Moiraine *admits*

    I mean that post. I can't be bothered to read the rest of her...thoughts. I don't know it's weird, because I kind of side with Rand on his Moiraine issue.

    Sent at 12:06 AM on Friday

     

    Kat: In a way she hasn't quite got the chivalry thing down. I believe it was started by a Lady who was disgusted by the deplorable way noblemen were treating women in general... although I am thinking back to college classes and I just tried googling and didn't find anything on the first page about it. So, that might not be right. But that's a roundabout way of saying that it's a little more complicated than that, although treating women like fragile objects incapable of making their own choices is not cool to me.

    I can see his point of view though.

     

    Marie: Well I see his point in that Moiraine took away his choice. I also feel she took away Lan's choice. I guess I'm more interested in Moiraine taking away people's choices than Leigh's political rants :P

     

    Kat: Moiraine did take away Lan's choices early on. More than one

    She acted before Rand could finish deciding more than took his choice away, I feel like.

     

    Marie: I refuse to chat about it because history has shown when we chat about something we tend to not repeat the good stuff on the forum :P Well, I know I tend to be lazy in that regard: "I told it to Kaitlin therefore the world"

     

    Kat: Say it in MW so we can discuss this thing :o

     

    Marie: You should make the thread *armfold* I can bribe you evily if you like

     

    I have made this thread! Now the discussion? :lol:

  10. Does he ever come here?

    in Kesiera

    Posted

    I actually don't know where to post on DM either. Even finding the right thread it's like the other side of wotmania's coin as far as the other posters go.

     

    I think wotism.net was another place I used to lurk. I like it here. Theoryland was ok but they got a lot wrong.

  12. Random XIII

    in Chatterbox

    Posted

    The most western place I've been was Columbus, well and then to Hillsboro from there. However, I plan to visit Chicago (and the west coast eventually). :)

     

    edit: A Forsaken should have a golden face. Better than a flamey one!

  20. Does he ever come here?

    in Kesiera

    Posted

    I forget how I got here. All of a sudden I was saying hello to Nancy, Laura and Marie and being a general pain.

     

    I used to go on theoryland, wotmania, and another... I forget what it was called. I didn't go on Dragonmount very much.

  22. Random XIII

    in Chatterbox

    Posted

    ........................ Jan's a girl????!!!!!:o:eek:;P;)

     

    :D Hasn't she said so before?

     

    I forget what my skype name is, Liv. Ask Jan if you find her on skype! Anybody can add me from here, btw. I don't mind! :lol:

  25. Random XIII

    in Chatterbox

    Posted

    I cannot believe that she blamed you for the cake incident!

     

    Clearly she was also wanting to bake another cake to make up for the cake you did not eat and then let you have none of that in retribution. So that would be two cakes you will not taste! I think you should steal that cake and share it with us. It is only right.

     

    My trip was sort of fun and sort of not fun. Next I want to go on a vacation to Europe, India, or Hawaii.

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