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[Split] Moiraine/Siuan Redux


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Thinking these things about Moiraine and Siuan has come after actually being silly enough to think very hard about their characters and motives. I'm not just assuming things based on life experiences I've had. I just do not think being lovers with each other was an isolated thing. I'm not doubting they liked men, or were with them. I'm not even saying it I believe it was a large number of women I believe they may have been with. I just don't think that in twenty years time the possibility can be totally ruled out, and I personally think that they did have other female lovers.

 

It's not that I think you are wrong, I just don't see it! I agree that you can't rule it out, but you can't really rule it in, either. That's why I keep probing you, because apparently the lesbian relationship between Elphie/Glinda is "obvious" yet it went completly over my head, so I'm wondering if I'm just that na

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Nope, not at all!

 

Basically, I at first didn't think much about their sexuality at all. But, I noticed that Moiraine acted in certain ways toward certain women and put a little flag next to that in my memory of pointless stuff. :D Then, when the Thom stuff became obvious I started wondering about first what might have been Moiraine's thought processes concerning Thom (because her PoVs are rare), and then put together the way she acted around him from the bits and pieces that were said about the beginning of the gang's trip from the Two Rivers and the other ways she acted toward women, and saw a similarity between them, and also a definite flirting style.

 

She's not a ho, but she's no prude either.

 

Siuan is much less sutble. Basically, from her thoughts on Moiraine, and the way she did not seem particulary shy about stating her thoughts on sexuality (though she usually ended up saying things in a very abrupt way that was a little shocking to other people around her - Min because she was talking to Mother, and Moiraine because Cairhienin don't talk like that for example) or about being with others, I took into consideration the difficulty that (silly) men had with channeling women, and also the difficulty that men have with women in power, and concluded that Siuan's choices were limited. She doesn't seem quite as prone to attraction to women as Moiraine sort of seems to be, but she's also practical - and there were a lot more times that she mentioned some physical sign of Moiraine's beauty. Also - she seems to be the type to get to know someone and find them more and more physically desirable the more she admires them.

 

That was a confusing look at part of my reasoning! :P

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Lol, I didn't like Thom at first but now am all obsessed with this idea that there is cuteness in him. :D

 

Also - I wanted to say before that maybe I am the one being naive and just misread a bunch of stuff. I don't know. It's very confusing to put into words how I came to think those things, because talking about getting to those points is not something I'm very good at.

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I know :P That's why I said "title". And you didn't let me down!

 

Elphie/Glinda are from the book Wicked; I only mentioned them because I knew Kate had read the novel.

 

@Kate: I'd like to know where you saw Moiraine's...whatever feelings for woman? I don't know what to call them even when referring to Thom! :D

 

And about Siuan, well, I'm not a Siuan fan anymore and haven't been since book six so I can't say yay or nay to your observations.

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*skims quickly over discussion that seems to be getting waaaay too deep for me* :D

 

I agree with Laura2 on a number of points, especially about writing off to RJ to clarify the point! And equally on being in denial about the Thom issue! Though I think you summed it up pretty well, Laura2, when you said, "most of what goes on between pilow friends in the tower doesn't necessarily define that characters sexuality, as it is a stressfull place and everyone needs some comfort". Generally speaking, that is.

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  • 9 months later...

Just a slight correction on Siuan.

 

Also, Siuan jokes with Min at one point and says she doesn't have time to take a lover. You can't rule out women because it doesn't specifically rule them out by that comment.

 

Right after that she says "There's no time for winking at the men when you're busy bailing the boat." It could be just another saying, but usually she means what she says even if it's wrapped up in different sorts of fish.

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  • 3 weeks later...
There's no time for winking at the men when you're busy bailing the boat

You have to remember that Aes Sedai are sneaky creatures. Note how she doesn't say anything about not having time to wink and women and/or fullfilling various carnal desires with said woman/women. Also she says that she doesn't have time for the above only when she is bailing a boat, which I can't see her doing very often nowadays.

 

Bow down before my irrefutable logic! :o

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